Veteran pastor lost bid to succeed influential
leader at NYC Baptist church over gender: suit
New York Post,
by
Kathianne Boniello
&
Dean Balsamini
Original Article
Posted By: Beardo,
1/6/2024 10:04:10 AM
A veteran pastor at Harlem’s Abyssinian Baptist Church was rejected in her bid to succeed longtime leader Rev. Calvin O. Butts III because the famed house of worship would “never hire a woman” for the job, she claims in a lawsuit.
Eboni Marshall Turman insisted she was the “strongest applicant” to replace Butts, who died of cancer in 2022 at age 73. (snip) Turman claims Grant grilled her “on topics that her male co-applicants were not asked,” and that Grant and another committee member said Abyssinian would have a female pastor “over [their] dead body,” according to the legal filing.
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Reply 1 - Posted by:
chumley 1/6/2024 10:18:58 AM (No. 1630737)
Why can't they hire whoever they want? Why do they have to hire some chick if they dont want to? The same question applies to every other protected category as well.
29 people like this.
Reply 2 - Posted by:
Venturer 1/6/2024 10:24:28 AM (No. 1630747)
In my most misogynist attitude toward women Pastors I agree with the Church.
A female preacher over my dead body.
I know that is offensive to some, but that's the way i feel.
33 people like this.
Reply 3 - Posted by:
DVC 1/6/2024 10:31:57 AM (No. 1630756)
Sorry, lady, some jobs are not for women. And if the congregation doesn't want you.....too bad.
34 people like this.
Reply 4 - Posted by:
Marzipan4 1/6/2024 10:42:04 AM (No. 1630773)
Uhhmmm, the Bible tells us so. Same attack on Baptist churches, same move to modernize G-d. Go read the southern Baptist convention notes. Go speak to Beth Moore who still a talented expositor, chafing against the order dictated by the Bible. You either walk the walk or talk the talk.
20 people like this.
Reply 5 - Posted by:
Kate318 1/6/2024 10:55:49 AM (No. 1630780)
#2, I feel the same way about female priests in the Catholic Church. We have the advantage of first-hand knowledge about potential female clergy through our interaction with nuns. They were insufferable enough as educators, and are now a breeding ground for woke activism and LGBTQ+ ideology. These would be the women who would relish having control by becoming priests. No thanks.
28 people like this.
Reply 6 - Posted by:
bamboozle 1/6/2024 11:09:02 AM (No. 1630795)
Does she want the job to serve Christ and the Gospel or to further her own ambitions?
30 people like this.
Reply 7 - Posted by:
Msquared112 1/6/2024 11:22:56 AM (No. 1630807)
Without exception, every female pastor/priest I've ever been exposed to has been a social justice warrior, whatever her color. My family has left all those churches. This may be controversial but women do not make good pastors, at least not from my experience, which is pretty extensive. Right now, we belong to a PCA (Presbyterian Church of America) conservative no-women-clergy Church and we are happy there. Women play important roles in all other aspects of the Church; teaching, ministries, child-care, etc. No one bitches about it and if they do, they wind up leaving.
20 people like this.
Reply 8 - Posted by:
nwcudagal 1/6/2024 12:07:44 PM (No. 1630843)
I was afraid this had to do with the entire misgendering fiasco. Let the best man win, I say.
6 people like this.
Reply 9 - Posted by:
cold porridge 1/6/2024 12:27:19 PM (No. 1630856)
Get over yourself lady.
15 people like this.
Reply 10 - Posted by:
FLCracker 1/6/2024 12:48:02 PM (No. 1630870)
Rev. Eboni's first problem seems to be that she does not believe in all the tenets expressed by the church she wants to run.
19 people like this.
Reply 11 - Posted by:
JoElla Bee 1/6/2024 1:06:41 PM (No. 1630876)
God established the roles to be performed by different members in the church.
"But now God has set the members, each one of them, in the body just as He pleased" (I Corinthians 12:18).
"Now I praise you, brethren, that you remember me in all things and keep the traditions just as I delivered them to you. But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God"
(I Corinthians 11:2-3).
God has given instructions for how He wants worship services to be conducted in the church.
"Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but they are to be submissive, as the law also says. And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church. Or did the word of God come originally from you? Or was it you only that it reached? If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things which I write to you are the commandments of the Lord"
(I Corinthians 14:34-37).
Women are needed in service to God. If Eboni Marshall Turman wants to truly demonstrate her love for the Lord, she needs to prayerfully study His Word (by which we all will be judged on the last day - John 12:48), and find the wonderful ways that women can serve Him according to His will & not her own. God’s way is always the right way, the best way & the only way to eternal life in heaven.
"Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me" (John 14:23-24).
It’s interesting to me that Satan chose to come to Eve in the Garden & persuaded her to disobey God’s clear instructions, then Eve persuaded Adam.
11 people like this.
Reply 12 - Posted by:
JoElla Bee 1/6/2024 1:09:37 PM (No. 1630878)
Sorry about the last of the comment in #11. Should have checked more closely!
2 people like this.
Reply 13 - Posted by:
JoElla Bee 1/6/2024 1:35:01 PM (No. 1630889)
Thanks, staff, if you removed the odd repetition mix up at the bottom of my comment in #11.
I have no idea how that happened!
3 people like this.
Reply 14 - Posted by:
SweetPea3 1/6/2024 1:51:57 PM (No. 1630896)
Well, #11, don't overlook the fact that Adam willingly chose to ignore what Father said. Little ol Eve did not bully or beat big strong Adam into ignoring Him. Adam fell for it hook, line, and sinker. Father cursed them BOTH and kicked them BOTH out of the Garden.
8 people like this.
Reply 15 - Posted by:
kono 1/6/2024 1:58:50 PM (No. 1630899)
Discrimination on the basis of sex or gender is only a matter of religious freedom if ones religion requires it. The secular religion says there's no difference, and gender ideology doesn't know what it believes (hence, the ever-expanding alphabet soup in its name). So if your religion keeps changing its teachings in response to changes in society, then you are obligated to change along with it.
Once Baptist doctrine embraced female pastors, the onus on church communities that still believed in the differences to leave the governing body that says there's no difference. Still Baptist? Surprise! You are obligated to follow civil government's lead...
1 person likes this.
Reply 16 - Posted by:
JoElla Bee 1/6/2024 2:07:41 PM (No. 1630902)
Yes, #14. I’m aware that Adam chose to go along with Eve in disobedience to God of his own free will.
My point was Satan’s strategy. He obviously uses our weaknesses against us.
5 people like this.
Reply 17 - Posted by:
Moritz55 1/6/2024 2:35:50 PM (No. 1630916)
Regardless of gender, politics, of whatever, what kind of ministry could this woman expect after suing to get her position. From experience, I can tell you that it’s tough enough serving as a pastor under the best circumstances. Under those circumstances? What a great way to sow division and empty the pews!
5 people like this.
This is a situation in which civil courts have NO JURISDICTION. The First Amendment was written to keep civil authorities out of the Church's business. Shame on this woman for filing a civil suit over a purely ecclesiastical matter.
10 people like this.
Reply 19 - Posted by:
anniebc 1/6/2024 2:45:44 PM (No. 1630925)
Being a female should disqualify her.
4 people like this.
Reply 20 - Posted by:
Maggie2u 1/6/2024 3:03:27 PM (No. 1630930)
I came here to say pretty much what poster #18 said.
The government has no business to interfere in the way a church is run unless they're doing something clearly illegal. If this woman wins, how soon will a woman sue the Catholic Church for not letting her become a priest?
3 people like this.
Reply 21 - Posted by:
moebellini3 1/6/2024 4:00:38 PM (No. 1630944)
Lol, what else is new.
0 people like this.
It doesn't matter what I think or feel. God detailed the requirements for pastors in the Word of God. Husband of one wife seems quite clear, regarding gender. Many wonderful female staff members have served in leadership in my church, but never in the pulpit as the lead pastor of the church.
A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
One that rules well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil. ~ I Timothy 3
5 people like this.
Reply 23 - Posted by:
Omen55 1/6/2024 7:48:08 PM (No. 1631030)
While you're at it why not sue the Catholic Church because the Pope is always a guy?
0 people like this.
Reply 24 - Posted by:
Miss T 1/6/2024 11:56:36 PM (No. 1631064)
Let the church file a summary judgement motion. They would win. There's plenty of on-point case law that ecclesiastical matters are not under the jurisdiction of civil courts.
Who is this woman's lawyer? The lawyer is either not too smart or not honest.
1 person likes this.
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