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EPA rule sharply limits HFCs, gases used
as refrigerants

Original Article

Posted By: Ribicon, 9/23/2021 1:09:09 PM

Washington—In what officials call a key step to combat climate change, the Environmental Protection Agency is sharply limiting domestic production and use of hydrofluorocarbons, highly potent greenhouse gases commonly used in refrigerators and air conditioners. The new rule announced Thursday follows through on a law Congress passed last year and is intended to decrease U.S. production and use of HFCs by 85% over the next 15 years, part of a global phaseout designed to slow global warming.(Snip)White House climate adviser Gina McCarthy, a former EPA administrator, said the new rule was "a win on climate and a win on jobs and American competitiveness. It's really, frankly, folks,


It's a wasteful "very big deal" to force Americans to replace their household AC systems (an enormous expense), ditch their cars when the AC systems are no longer rechargeable, and buy new refrigerators at the whim of a regulator. Likewise businesses and schools, all costs passed along to us. Sure, they say, if you're smart like us you'll have summer homes and winter homes you can use when it becomes uncomfortable, and your chauffeured vehicles are provided free by the taxpayers. By what authority do these criminals operate, and why did Donald Trump fail to shut this agency down, along with several others?

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Reply 1 - Posted by: Heil Liberals 9/23/2021 1:13:56 PM (No. 924024)
So, now they want to outlaw air conditioning... except for the usual scum who are excluded from/above the law. Filthy communist pigs, the lot of them.
43 people like this.

Reply 2 - Posted by: red1066 9/23/2021 1:14:02 PM (No. 924025)
I hope the electric grid is strong enough to power all the fans during the summer.
16 people like this.

Reply 3 - Posted by: harleynyc 9/23/2021 1:14:05 PM (No. 924026)
the fix is in. lobbyists working overtime. politicians and their offshore bank accounts.
22 people like this.

Reply 4 - Posted by: DVC 9/23/2021 1:15:26 PM (No. 924028)
So, your next repair job on your AC or your next refrigerator just doubled or tripled in price, most likely.
26 people like this.

Reply 5 - Posted by: CactusStar 9/23/2021 1:16:37 PM (No. 924030)
When they start calling us "folks" you know they are screwing us.
29 people like this.

Reply 6 - Posted by: DVC 9/23/2021 1:17:35 PM (No. 924031)
Well, we can go back to ammonia as a refrigerant. It works extremely well, and is efficient and cheap. And if it leaks out, it will harm you or kill you. Minor inconvenience. Take a few dead Americans to "save the ecology".
14 people like this.

Reply 7 - Posted by: Lazyman 9/23/2021 1:19:47 PM (No. 924034)
When your outside condenser goes you will have to replace the inside air handler too. A big win for the manufacture. More money being kicked up to the Dim party and another victory for crony capitalism.
20 people like this.

Reply 8 - Posted by: Ribicon 9/23/2021 1:21:44 PM (No. 924040)
The deal here, as I remember, is that the patent expired on Freon, so it was determined that Freon was destroying the ozone layer and had to be phased out. So in comes a new class of refrigerants made of smaller molecules and operating under much higher pressure, which greatly increases costs of manufacture and complicates servicing, and also makes leaks more likely. This also endangers the environment, so now we're back to square one, which involves extracting as much money from people as possible, ideally providing them with nothing in return. This is the American way.
19 people like this.

Reply 9 - Posted by: minuteman 9/23/2021 1:24:07 PM (No. 924046)
I missed the part in the Constitution that says government agencies can pass laws.
30 people like this.

Reply 10 - Posted by: Daisymay 9/23/2021 1:24:22 PM (No. 924047)
Well, when I was VERY Young, one of my favorite things was chasing the Horse Drawn Wagon bringing Ice Blocks to our Little Refrigerator! The Driver would always shave off a piece of Ice for us Kids. We loved it! I guess we might all have to go back to that very Tiny Refrigerator if the Democrats have their way. I know one thing, I will move from Florida if we have to give up our Air Conditioning. Can't hardly stand the Summers here as it is!! So glad I'm 80! Not that many years left to have to deal with the Idiots in Washington D.C.! Every Day it's something new. I think they just sit around and say, okay, it's your turn to think of something really Stupid to push on the American People!
23 people like this.

Reply 11 - Posted by: SkeezerMcGee 9/23/2021 1:32:25 PM (No. 924054)
"Transitioning to safer alternatives and more energy-efficient cooling technologies is expected to generate more than $270 billion in cost savings and public health benefits over the next 30 years, Regan said. If these safer, more energy-efficient cooling, and $270 billion cost saving technologies exist they would already be used by the relevant industries. My assumption is do not exist. If eventually produced there's no guarantee they will more beneficial to the envitonment than the existing technologies. They may reduce carbon dioxide but concurrently cause more harm to the environment.
10 people like this.

Reply 12 - Posted by: rochow 9/23/2021 1:36:15 PM (No. 924058)
Just wait until they swelter in their congressional chambers and their homes, apartments!! Oooops, all of a sudden everything THEY need will not be environmentally outlawed but as usual our betters (the elected scum) will have access to everything. They are not the little people, we are!
11 people like this.

Reply 13 - Posted by: Birddog 9/23/2021 1:38:54 PM (No. 924062)
Gonna outlaw all machines that use them...requiring people to buy new MUCH more expensive equipt, that actually uses MORE energy to manufacture and run...then charge the people to dump them, but dumps won't accept them with the coolant still in them soooo...people will just chop the tubing and dump the HFC's directly into the atmosphere. Just the urethane foam needed for the new equipment will release MORE HFC's than will be saved.. In the meantime, volcanoes spouting 100's of times the Global warming gasses at 1500degrees Fahrenheit are making a mockery of these verrrrry expensive and infinitesimal attempts to intentionally alter the global climate. Siberia is one of the coldest areas on the planet, sparsest population, nearly 100% Untouched/Natural/boreal rainforest, NO human influence, yet 69,000 square miles of it are on fire(More than all of the other fires in the entire world combined), spewing smoke/soot/global warming gasses as well as hot air hundreds of degrees above "Normal" over that entire fact delivering soot/smoke to the NorthPole for the first time in recorded history.
11 people like this.

Reply 14 - Posted by: MarkTwain 9/23/2021 1:43:05 PM (No. 924063)
The last time we saw this it was Al Gore and the Great Ozone Hole scare. In reality Duponts patent on Freon was expiring and they needed to outlaw it before anyone else could make it cheaper, so the gullible fool Al Gore ramped up the ozone hole fear porn (sound familiar?) and the government stepped in to fix the problem. Now it's "climate change!" fear porn and somehow I'll wager that Dupont already has the 'solution' waiting in the wings. It's no coincidence this is supported by two Senators from states where Dupont has large plants. And as with the Freon replacement, the slyly named Puron, the replacement will not be as efficient at cooling and our air conditioners will use more power to achieve the same end. But the suckers will praise it because they can feel good about healing the planet.
13 people like this.

Reply 15 - Posted by: hershey 9/23/2021 1:47:07 PM (No. 924067)
Oh goody, I'm gonna run right out and open a franchise delivering blocks of ice to homes...I'll make a mint!!!!
8 people like this.

Reply 16 - Posted by: Bur Oak 9/23/2021 1:48:01 PM (No. 924069)
First it was a ban on R22 to save the ozone hole which was never a problem. Also banned was Halon a safe fire extinguishing gas. Everyone was then forced to use R134. Now we have to ban it to save the climate which isn't a problem. It would be much more effective and efficient to eliminate the EPA. Tyrants must tyrannize. This is your deep state at work.
29 people like this.

Reply 17 - Posted by: marbles 9/23/2021 1:54:54 PM (No. 924075)
The EPA , doing everything they can to make the USA a 3rd world..........well, you know.
23 people like this.

Reply 18 - Posted by: DVC 9/23/2021 2:07:27 PM (No. 924082)
Pretty close to exactly correct, #8. But the ecocrazies' idea that Freon was destroying the ozone layer (total fiction, literally impossible the way they claim) came first, before the whole 'hey, our patents are out' idea. And for about a year or two after the "destroying the ozone layer" hysteria, there were technical articles in engineering magazines explaining how the whole idea was just pure nonsense. Then suddenly, all these real world pushback articles stopped, and everything went quiet on the tech news sources. A more gullible, idealistic me was baffled. One of the key points in the 'destroy the ozone' BS claim is when the escaped freon "rises into the stratosphere to catalyze the ozone depletion". Freon is about 1,000 times heavier than air, and it will rise into the stratosphere about the same time that granite boulders start floating in lakes. It wasn't until about 4 or 5 years later that I figured out that Mexican refrigerant manufacturing was undercutting the US companies' price of the original Freon 12 (cars and refrigerators) and Freon 22 (home air conditioners) since the patents were long expired. So, the big chem companies like DuPont shut down the public tech pushback against the ecofiction and set their huge staffs of chemical engineers on a search for a new refrigerant that they could patent. Of course, they created some new refrigerants and patented them. So, for 20 years, they chem companies had a new patent lock on the market for refrigerants, and made more profits, by not fighting the ecocrazies' lies. Now new ecocrazies are back, with new lies. The first new set of refrigerants (R-134a in cars) ran at higher pressures than the original, so the whole AC unit or refrigerator cost more to make, sold for more. This could be the next cycle, too. A new class of refrigerants created, probably higher pressure and less efficient, likely more costly to make the refrigerant and the AC or refrigerator. Everyone profits except the ordinary consumer who is screwed again. Interesting tech note. If anyone was still running an old 60s or 70s era auto air conditioner system (seems unlikely) and can't get the necessary Freon 12 any more, propane is a literally perfect replacement refrigerant gas. It works at almost exactly the same pressures and temperatures, cheap and readily available. Some say that it could cause an explosion.....which is ridiculous because inside the AC system there is zero air, and propane can only burn in air. It is just as likely to spontaneously explode in the propane tank as it would be to explode in an AC system, each an air-free environment.
11 people like this.

Reply 19 - Posted by: mc squared 9/23/2021 2:22:36 PM (No. 924099)
In the last decade, even car I'very owned has required the 'new' refrigerent. It was uneconomical to repair my old F22 central air system, requiring a totally new one, and my refrigerator says the new gas in it is flammable. We are dismantling our society because it's run by greedy, ignorant, unelected bureaucrats.
13 people like this.

Reply 20 - Posted by: padiva 9/23/2021 3:04:51 PM (No. 924128)
First step: Turn off all Air conditioning in ALL federal buildings next summer.
10 people like this.

Reply 21 - Posted by: mathman 9/23/2021 4:25:53 PM (No. 924190)
Immediate: No air conditioning in any building on Capitol Hill. No AC in Congress. None in the white House. None at the Supreme Court. Cut them all off. AC makes global warming. Let them suffer. No AC in any Congressional office. They can make do with fans. Nope. No fans. Fans use electricity. No electricity. Let them make do with candles. No paper, no computers, no telephones. Let them use messengers. Back to the stone age.
5 people like this.

Reply 22 - Posted by: caljeepgirl 9/23/2021 5:25:19 PM (No. 924241)
The operative phrase being "The new rule announced Thursday follows through on a law Congress passed last year..." I think it's long past time to dump all of Congress (kinda' like dumping all your Scrabble tiles and starting over!)....enough of passing these generic laws without the specifics!!! And BTW, I don't remember any mention of "federal agencies" in our Constitution. So many stupid government idiots (guess that's redundant), so little time!
3 people like this.

Reply 23 - Posted by: kono 9/23/2021 5:32:24 PM (No. 924250)
Legislating innovation is one of my all-time favorite pet peeves. Arrogant asses running government think that technical limits are always temporary. None of them seems to have progressed beyond a 4th or 5th grade understanding of math or science. Just like the science-disabled asses who are navigating our path through this covid crap.
6 people like this.

Reply 24 - Posted by: MickTurn 9/23/2021 7:12:19 PM (No. 924374)
Oh, so the Ozone hole was a lie, what about the Biden Hole infesting the white house?
1 person likes this.

Reply 25 - Posted by: Salt5792 9/23/2021 9:58:25 PM (No. 924494)
Human activity has no effect on global climate
0 people like this.

Reply 26 - Posted by: Penney 9/23/2021 10:51:08 PM (No. 924522)
If AL Sharpton et AL socialist/dem pols would pay their taxes there might be enough money to fund the wacky leftists' fantasies in a rew centuries.
0 people like this.

Reply 27 - Posted by: Rumblehog 9/23/2021 11:50:14 PM (No. 924564)
More people will simply turn to using gases like Propane as their refrigerant. Think I'm kidding? It does work.
0 people like this.

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