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Justices Sharply Divided
in Wedding Cake Case

New York Times, by Adam Liptak

Original Article

Posted By:Drive, 12/5/2017 12:27:04 PM

WASHINGTON — Justice Anthony M. Kennedy, who almost certainly holds the crucial vote in the case of a Colorado baker who refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple, sent sharply contradictory messages when it was argued Tuesday at the Supreme Court. He asked a lawyer for the Trump administration whether the baker, Jack Phillips, could put a sign in his window saying, “We don’t bake cakes for gay weddings.” The lawyer, Noel J. Francisco said yes, so long as the cakes were custom made. Justice Kennedy looked troubled and said the administration’s position was an affront to the dignity

      


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Reply 1 - Posted by: thomthomp, 12/5/2017 12:33:34 PM     (No. 11471294)

It´s the New York Times. Believe nothing.

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Reply 2 - Posted by: Cliff, 12/5/2017 12:36:54 PM     (No. 11471300)

Any of the supremes who are against the baker are too stupid to be on the court!

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Reply 3 - Posted by: killerbee, 12/5/2017 12:42:39 PM     (No. 11471306)

Hm. That doesn´t sound good from Kennedy. I´m waiting for the decision to simply read: Muh Feelz!

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Reply 4 - Posted by: zephyrgirl, 12/5/2017 12:45:46 PM     (No. 11471315)

What goes unsaid in the coverage of this case is that the two gays were activists who targeted the shop, made a scene in the shop, and triggered (perhaps coordinated) hundreds of abusive and threatening phone calls to the shop. It was so bad that Jack Phillips wouldn´t let his employees answer the phone.

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Reply 5 - Posted by: Boston Federalist, 12/5/2017 12:49:01 PM     (No. 11471322)

This will be another perfect opportunity for Kennedy to get on his moral high horse and issue a pompous, holier-than-thou opinion that will be legally and logically incomprehensible.

The baker will lose and Kennedy will write the opinion. Then he will go up to the New York Times´ editor´s office (might as well bring McCain and Flake with him for good measure) to get the good-little-boy pat on the head, and he´ll drool like a puppy.

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Reply 6 - Posted by: rinohunter, 12/5/2017 12:50:24 PM     (No. 11471325)

Along with BLM, the case of the faggolas is a case to FORCE businesses to do things that proclaiming this a "free country" precludes.

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Reply 7 - Posted by: Whamdbambam, 12/5/2017 12:58:53 PM     (No. 11471334)

Our self-appointed arbiter of all things moral needs to be removed from the Court.

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Reply 8 - Posted by: wilarrbie, 12/5/2017 1:08:08 PM     (No. 11471339)

Can he put a sign in the window that says We specialize in hetero wedding cakes?

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Reply 9 - Posted by: web, 12/5/2017 1:11:33 PM     (No. 11471340)

Freedom of Religion is guaranteed to American citizens in our Constitution. Freedom of Perversion is not. What´s so hard about it? We have had enough of crazy people suing and trying to force us to endorse and take part in their perversions. Government has no authority or right to force us to endorse things we do not wish to take part in.

I will not read the article, since it comes from a Fake News site, but I assume the last line refers to "the dignity" of homosexuals. You cannot affront something that does not exist.

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Reply 10 - Posted by: Maggie2u, 12/5/2017 1:14:23 PM     (No. 11471341)

Put a sign in the window declaring this is a sanctuary business. We obey the laws we like and ignore the laws we don´t like.

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Reply 11 - Posted by: NorthernDog, 12/5/2017 1:24:35 PM     (No. 11471354)

Can´t wait to see Muslim meat shops being required to offer Kosher products.

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Reply 12 - Posted by: cheeflo, 12/5/2017 1:31:48 PM     (No. 11471360)

And Justice Kennedy´s decision in this matter was/is an affront to the dignity of the institution of marriage. Dignity is hard to find in sexual activity as it´s characterized these days (homosexual or heterosexual). Let´s face it, it is about as base an impulse as it gets, not to say it´s not ennobled when love and procreation are part of the picture.

Selling a cake off the shelf is one thing. Baking a custom cake is quite another. No one in the private sector should be forced by the government to provide any service.

Can he not see that compelling someone to act against his/her conscience is unconstitutional? Apparently not.

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Reply 13 - Posted by: Patchy Groundfog, 12/5/2017 1:33:02 PM     (No. 11471362)

The top level court in the land dealing with wedding cakes is an affront to liberty and sanity.

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Reply 14 - Posted by: luandir, 12/5/2017 1:34:22 PM     (No. 11471363)

Mr. Kennedy cannot retire soon enough.

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Reply 15 - Posted by: horacer, 12/5/2017 1:45:28 PM     (No. 11471383)

This whole matter is ridiculous. The shop owner never discriminated. He would have sold the couple anything in his shop, he would have made them any type of custom cake except one that went against his religious principles. How is this even an issue. What is wrong with us. Don´t all religions deserve respect. Certain Native American sects are allowed to smoke illegal substances, peyote, in their ceremonies. It´s religious freedom. How can you force a man to express support of something that goes against his religious beliefs.

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Reply 16 - Posted by: ilovedogs, 12/5/2017 1:51:19 PM     (No. 11471392)

And the practical point is there were many other bakers just walk out and shake it off and go find one that would bake you the best one ever.

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Reply 17 - Posted by: greggojo, 12/5/2017 1:54:03 PM     (No. 11471398)

In addition to #4´s informative post, the media is careful not to show the custom cakes created by this baker. His cakes are as close to art, or are art, as a decorated cake could be. They are extremely unique and quite beautiful. No doubt in addition to not allowing the point that they are art to be made, the media also wants to avoid giving any free positive publicity to the baker. (PS I hate the American press. Their bias is so downright blatant. And they have given us nothing but rotten advice for as long as I can remember. We certainly have the press (who strongly supports Dem politicians) to thank for the absolute wretchedness in our inner cities. And the millions of poorly educated, non-English speaking illegal aliens who have burdened our schools, hospitals and welfare systems).

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Reply 18 - Posted by: southernboy, 12/5/2017 2:13:21 PM     (No. 11471429)

The point completely ignored, which is the whole point of contention, is what the decoration was they wanted on the top of the cake.

It was something lewd and indecent having to do with Gay lifestyle. That´s where the baker drew the line!

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Reply 19 - Posted by: uno, 12/5/2017 2:17:07 PM     (No. 11471437)

Let´s all chug on over to Moe´s Muzlim restaurant and demand BLT´s!

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Reply 20 - Posted by: avanti1, 12/5/2017 2:21:35 PM     (No. 11471443)

This case is not about baking a cake, it is about the gay couple´s demand that the baker be forced to dedicate his talent, time and effort in a fashion desired by the couple.

It appears as though the baker did NOT discriminate by refusing to sell them a standard, premade cake, only that he declined to make a custom cake for them.

No one is dictating or demanding a particular pattern of behavior of the couple, why are they demanding a particular pattern of behavior on the part of the baker?

Are some people more equal than others?

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Reply 21 - Posted by: avanti1, 12/5/2017 2:26:07 PM     (No. 11471448)

FTA: "Kristen K. Waggoner, a lawyer for Mr. Phillips, said her client was an artist, one who created a sort of sculpture.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor appeared unpersuaded. “When have we ever given protection to a food?” she asked."

I seem to recall that protections were given to a bottle of urine deemed to be "art."

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Reply 22 - Posted by: msjena, 12/5/2017 2:30:30 PM     (No. 11471458)

When Justice Kennedy mentions "dignity," it´s not a good sign. That said, religious freedom is a express Constitutional right. Can a state or city´s anti-discrimination law trump it?


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Reply 23 - Posted by: rubberneck, 12/5/2017 2:40:57 PM     (No. 11471470)

I´ve had a hard time smiling about this case... but #10 gave me a smile. THANKS!

Are there cake shops in big cities (you know, where people are "open minded"), that have a big assortment of wedding cake toppers?...
- man in tux, woman in beautiful white gown (traditional)
- two men in tuxes
- two women in white gowns
- man with two brides
- bride and groom both in leather with whips and handcuffs
- man and young girl
- man and young boy
- man and sheep with fishnet stockings
... etc?

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Reply 24 - Posted by: msjena, 12/5/2017 2:41:25 PM     (No. 11471471)

Sorry to post again, but the questio about race is different because the baker´s religion doesn´t approve of racial discrimination. It is consistent with the law so there is no infringement on the baker´s rights. And the baker here isn´t refusing to deal with gay people; he is only refusing to make a cake for something he doesn´t believe in. They can still buy a cake or even ask for a cake with specific flavors,etc. The baker is saying he will not create and decorate a cake that celebrates gay marriage.

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Reply 25 - Posted by: judy, 12/5/2017 2:48:14 PM     (No. 11471477)

They will not allow conservatives to speak at colleges, yet they want them to bake their cakes.

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Reply 26 - Posted by: Felixcat, 12/5/2017 2:52:40 PM     (No. 11471483)

But "no shoes no service" is legal?

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Reply 27 - Posted by: wilarrbie, 12/5/2017 3:23:34 PM     (No. 11471519)

Good point #11. Will butcher shops be required to provide halal meats?

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Reply 28 - Posted by: Me_Opinionated_Nah, 12/5/2017 3:40:18 PM     (No. 11471536)

Point of Order (or something)!

I just heard Sarah Sanders say "As I said..."
I heard her say it twice. Not "Like I said..."
"AS I SAID..."

I´m so proud.


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Reply 29 - Posted by: anonymous, 12/5/2017 4:07:06 PM     (No. 11471556)

Wedding cakes come from the same batter. There´s no difference between the flour or the eggs or the sugar between wedding cake A and wedding cake B. If a same-sex couple insisted on the baker using sugar imported from Burundi, the baker would be within his rights to refuse their request but not otherwise.

Unusual requests can always be denied by a baker but this case before the Supreme Court is about whether a baker can refuse to serve a product that is run-of-the-mill for his business.

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Reply 30 - Posted by: Muguy, 12/5/2017 4:40:07 PM     (No. 11471573)

Whenever Kennedy speaks, foolishness begins.

Some of the members of the Court need to actually realize that the Constitution guides them, not their own views.

We are not governed by pop culture or what a justice thinks is "fair".

There were other persons who could have made a cake, but to compel someone to do it when there are others to do it, strikes at the heart of our most basic values.

For the court to FORCE someone to do it in order to RUIN them for their convictions is wrong.

What if the baker was a moooooslim? We that person be compelled to do it?

What should be an issue of how one conducts his business is the issue, not promoting a gay agenda over a conscientious refusal.

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Reply 31 - Posted by: zephyrgirl, 12/5/2017 5:07:41 PM     (No. 11471602)

Here´s another tidbit - they´ve cleaned up the gay couple and made them look respectable. Earlier pictures make them look like the wierdos they really are.

#17 is correct about Jack Phillips´ cakes. I´ve had him make several for me. Every cake was a work of art, even when I said, "just put some nice colorful flowers on the top..."

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Reply 32 - Posted by: bobgray2, 12/5/2017 5:20:19 PM     (No. 11471613)

Wedding cakes are art. Imagine going up to any artist no matter what the medium and demanding that they perform for you to your specifications, and if they don´t, they will be sued. Dance monkeys, dance.

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Reply 33 - Posted by: snakeoil, 12/5/2017 5:33:08 PM     (No. 11471624)

Am ambivalent about this. Anyone should have the right to refuse anyone as a customer. All those restaurants that say: "No Shoes, No Socks, Noe Shirt, No Service" certainly have the right. I would have just baked a kitty litter cake and charged them $ 5k and if they didn´t pay charge them with breach of contract.

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Reply 34 - Posted by: Rumblehog, 12/5/2017 5:56:36 PM     (No. 11471647)

Life, Liberty, and the PURSUIT of Happiness. Them sick homos can ´pursue happiness´ at another bake shop then another then another...

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Reply 35 - Posted by: Udanja99, 12/5/2017 6:33:04 PM     (No. 11471671)

If I had been the baker I think I would have simply said, “Wedding cakes like mine take a great deal of time. Let me check my schedule... Oh, sorry, I’m completely booked for that month”.

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Reply 36 - Posted by: Harlowe, 12/5/2017 10:01:19 PM     (No. 11471803)

First Amendment, U. S. Constitution: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech,…” The “law” is clear, no “prohibiting the FREE EXERCISE thereof (religion).” The text does not include “dignity.” “Dignity” is an innate, inherent value and worth as human beings. “Law” consists of rules recognized and enforced by judicial decisions (U.S.Constitution). The bottom line is does anyone have the right to exercise their freedom of religion (law), yes or no. Reality Check: The U. S. Constitution makes allowance for conscientious objectors based on religious beliefs.

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Reply 37 - Posted by: saguni, 12/5/2017 10:36:06 PM     (No. 11471824)

I wish there were a storing religious freedom (or some such) law, that stated if an activist must drive past a business that would provide the service as requested in order to (1) reach the business of a religious person and (2) be denied the service requested in order to (3) file a complaint, then the penalty due the business will be doubled and charged to the activist complainant.

But, then, I do have an active fantasy life.

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Reply 38 - Posted by: Charactercounts, 12/6/2017 12:21:21 AM     (No. 11471869)

#23, Years ago, there was a bakery in New York that was famous for selling cakes with the most lewd decoration. People would avert their eyes when they passed the window.

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Reply 39 - Posted by: ColonialAmerican1623, 12/6/2017 12:28:50 AM     (No. 11471873)

I heard these two girly men on the radio today. Little over the top. When gays demand Muzlims bake a cake for them or cater a BBQ for the reception, we will know they tried everybody.
Not happening.

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Reply 40 - Posted by: 49 Ford, 12/6/2017 4:00:17 AM     (No. 11471911)

My gut feeling is that #5 is right. The decision will be filled with sanctimonious fluff and bereft of fealty to the Constitution.


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Mediaite, by Justin Baragona    Original Article
Posted By: KarenJ1- 12/9/2017 3:42:41 PM     Post Reply
Prior to President Donald Trump’s visit to the opening of the Mississippi Civil Rights Museum today, Fox & Friends brought on Trump supporter and former sheriff David Clarke to discuss the president’s appearance. And things got very tense very fast. Right off the bat, co-host Pete Hegseth asked Clarke what he thought about Rep. John Lewis (D-GA), a civil rights icon, deciding not to attend the opening because Trump would be in attendance. Clarke reacted by immediately dismissing Lewis. “John who?” Clarke mocking stated. “John Lewis — he was bloodied on the Selma bridge, Sheriff, when trying to protest voting

Why I Can No Longer Call
Myself an Evangelical Republican

34 replie(s)
New York Times, by Peter Wehner    Original Article
Posted By: bemused conservative- 12/10/2017 8:05:09 AM     Post Reply
There are times in life when the institutional ground underneath you begins to crumble — and with it, longstanding attachments. Such is the case for me when it comes to the Republican Party and evangelicalism. I’ve been a part of both for my entire adult life. These days, though, in many important ways they are having harmful effects on our society. The latest example is in Alabama, where Roy Moore, the Republican Senate candidate, stands accused of varying degrees of sexual misconduct by nine women, including one who was 14 years old at the time. Mr. Moore leads in most

California governor blames devastating wildfires
on climate change and says deadly winter infernos
will be ´the new normal´

34 replie(s)
Daily Mail (UK), by Keith Griffith    Original Article
Posted By: M2- 12/10/2017 8:41:56 AM     Post Reply
California´s governor has said that deadly wildfires in the winter will be ´the new normal´, as fire crews rushed to contain the fires, with dry desert winds expected to intensify over the weekend. Governor Jerry Brown on Saturday toured Ventura County neighborhoods ravaged by a weeklong wildfire that killed at least one person and destroyed hundreds of homes and other buildings. At a news conference, the Democrat said drought and climate change mean California faces a ´new reality´ where lives and property are continually threatened by fire, at a cost of billions of dollars. He added that gusty winds and

Sarah Silverman recalls being
‘scared, ‘shaken’ when boyfriend
flew U.S. flag: ‘I was freaking out’

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Washington Times, by Jessica Chasmar    Original Article
Posted By: NorthernDog- 12/8/2017 5:03:42 PM     Post Reply
Comedian Sarah Silverman addressed the topic of American nationalism during a monologue on her Hulu talk show Thursday night, describing the “visceral reaction” and fear she felt when an old boyfriend of hers hoisted an American flag on his own property. (Snip) “[My sister] was like, ‘Dude, nationalism is innately terrifying for Jews. Think about it: flags, marching, blind allegiance — these things tend to ring a bell for us,’” she said. “Right. Of course. Duh. It made sense. And it made me realize that the things that terrify some people are the same things that give other people great

California gov: Trump doesn’t fear
God or ‘existential consequences’

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The Hill [Washington, DC], by Julia Manchester    Original Article
Posted By: KarenJ1- 12/9/2017 10:35:14 AM     Post Reply
California Gov. Jerry Brown (D) says President Trump´s stance on climate change demonstrates that he does not appear to fear the "wrath of God" or have any regard for the "existential consequences" of his climate change policies. “I don’t think President Trump has a fear of the Lord, the fear of the wrath of God, which leads one to more humility ... this is such a reckless disregard for the truth and for the existential consequences that can be unleashed,” Brown said in an interview on CBS´s "60 Minutes," which is set to air on Sunday. Brown, who previously studied to become

Maybe Trump needs emergency
brain repair after slurred speech

28 replie(s)
NY Daily News, by Linda Stasi    Original Article
Posted By: Scottyboy- 12/9/2017 11:17:50 PM     Post Reply
Loose dentures? More like loose screws. Donald Trump was slurring his words pretty good last week for a guy who fancied himself an expert when it came to Hillary Clinton’s alleged brain damage. What would he make of his own slurred speech and bizarre behavior? brain tumor from the weight of that massive combover sitting on top of his head like a live farm animal? Simply slurred speech because his thoughts are so fantastic that his mouth can’t keep up?

Firing Mueller would be disastrous;
discrediting him is impeachment politics

28 replie(s)
Washington Examiner, by Byron York    Original Article
Posted By: FlyRight- 12/10/2017 7:14:26 AM     Post Reply
Short of impeaching President Trump, does anything excite Democrats, the Resistance, and NeverTrumpers like the prospect of the president firing special counsel Robert Mueller? Firing Mueller would, or course, be the quickest way for Trump to get impeached, which might explain a certain air of anticipation in discussions of whether — some prefer to say when -- Trump will sack the prosecutor leading the Trump-Russia investigation.There has been a lot of news and commentary recently interpreting criticism of Mueller by a number of pro-Trump media voices as an effort to encourage Trump to fire Mueller, or lay the groundwork for

Inside Trump´s Hour-by-Hour
Battle for Self-Preservation

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New York Times, by Maggie Haberman and Glenn Thrush    Original Article
Posted By: FlyRight- 12/9/2017 1:49:27 PM     Post Reply
WASHINGTON — Around 5:30 each morning, President Trump wakes and tunes into the television in the White House’s master bedroom. He flips to CNN for news, moves to “Fox & Friends” for comfort and messaging ideas, and sometimes watches MSNBC’s “Morning Joe” because, friends suspect, it fires him up for the day. Energized, infuriated — often a gumbo of both — Mr. Trump grabs his iPhone. Sometimes he tweets while propped on his pillow, according to aides. Other times he tweets from the den next door, watching another television. Less frequently, he makes his way up the hall to the

Skier feuds with Trump, injures herself
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Donsurber.com, by Don Surber    Original Article
Posted By: earlybird- 12/10/2017 5:52:53 AM     Post Reply
From Fox News: Olympic star Lindsey Vonn says she won´t represent Trump at 2018 Winter Games Hmm. She might not represent him or anyone else after injuring her back today. Vonn virtue-signaled this week on CNN. From Fox News: “I hope to represent the people of the United States, not the president,” Vonn said this week amid the buildup to the 2018 games in PyeongChang, South Korea.(Snip) She joins a choir of millionaire athletes pandering to pretentious liberals and Antifa fascists. Today, the Associated Press reported: Lindsey Vonn finished a World Cup super-G in extreme pain Saturday and was treated by race doctors for a back injury. The


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