Yesterday, the most modest of gun control proposals died in the Senate. It would have expanded background checks to people purchasing weapons at gun shows and online sales, enjoyed 90 per cent support among the public and came on the back of the tragedy at Newtown. Yet, despite all that it had going for it, the Toomey-Manchin bill raised just 54 votes--six short of the number necessary for passage. “This is a pretty shameful day for Washington,” said Obama afterwards. It wasn’t exactly a red letter day for him, either. Why did the no-brainer bill fail? Four reasons:
Ok, first of all, I do not believe that 90% of Americans supported the bill. Even reading the basis for that claim does not support it, if you read carefully. 90% of Americans support background checks to buy a gun. However, a large number of Americans know that you need to have a background check to buy a gun in most cases ALREADY. So, a large number of those who support background checks believe that the current law is sufficient.
Second, I do not agree with the idea that liberals are not as tenacious as conservatives. What I believe is that Americans are finally figuring out that "liberals" are more tenacious. They will never be satisfied until guns are banned. So if this law was passed expanding background checks and further restricting the right to buy guns, they would be back trying to expand further restrict the right to own guns before the ink was dry. And I am confident that there would have been some provision in the law which would have been interpreted to restrict gun ownership in ways that no one anticipated before the law was passed (or at least which would have been vociferously denied until after the law was passed).
Reply 5 - Posted by:
Fiesta del sol, 4/18/2013 7:00:02 AM (No. 9281928)
Watching Morning Joe this morning makes me glad I a, not playing the drinking game with the phrase "90%". If only Mika and Joe cared as much about the millions killed by the likes of Kermit Gosnell.
I believe that the media´s non stop harangue since Newtown helped defeat this bill. Having Soledad O´Brien, Piers Morgan and everyone on MSNBC calling for gun control outside of Sandy Hook school before the bodies were taken out was sick.
I agree with #1 that the biggest problem is gun control is unconstitutional as Ted Cruz brilliantly pointed out during hearings. Every time the MSM played the video to attack Cruz, they convinced more of the People that this campaign to control guns was simply wrong.
Wacko liberal friend of mine believes the majority of Americans want gun control. I see where she gets her information. Fact - most of us don´t want control. This is just another lie from the disgusting things in the White House and MSM.
Personally, I love it when Obama bangs his little fists on his high chair. He is so obnoxious that I enjoy seeing him defeated just to watch his response. Seriously though, I believe that the majority of this country is very troubled by what they see coming out of this administration. Americans are not stupid, they know their only ace in the hole is the Second Amendment. A serious and thoughtful President would have addressed the root cause of the ineffective and very dangerous mental health system in this country. However, we know Obama is an ideologue first and foremost.
Just days after the terror attack in Boston I doubt that most Americans want to surrender their gun rights. If anything, more people are realizing they may need a gun, and that will be their own choice.
back in 94 demorats like slick willy said 80% suported the assalt wepon ban sara brady was gleefuly saying hand guns would be baned by 2000 and in 94 dems lost congress for the first time in 40 years 60 dem congressmen and 10 senators lost i will tell you 2014 looks very bad for demorats and it will get even worse
1. This is a UK report 2. We beat the British Army like currs 3. Enacted our own freedoms 4. Like the 2nd Amendment, and 5. Latest Gallup Poll says only 4% of Americans think "gun control" is a big deal 6. But 90% of Americans say the Constitution IS a big deal
I´m sorry that I can´t cite the specifics of this, but on his afternoon show in ATL yesterday Erick Erickson reported that the 90% was from a survey taken from a limited amount of states in and around the DC area. It was not a nationwide poll. There´s no way they could´ve come to that 90% number if the poll had been nationwide.
Zippy´s hissy was most unbecoming of a US President, but sadly I´ve become used to it. I just wish he´d take his basketball and go home to Chicago.
I am so sick of this: where does this british rag get off saying that 90% support this bill? Where did they take their poll? What do they have to back that up? Will they ever show that? NO...but 90% of the lo-fos out there are already incorporating it into their kneejerk response to those of us who are happy this bill didnt pass. One one social media outlet I am on, it has already made the rounds among the younger set. They think that an article written by some JournOlister is like an election...all Tim had to do was pick a number out of his stupid head and it was the truth!
WHY CANT WE HOLD JOURNOLISTERS ACCOUNTABLE LIKE WE CAN LAWYERS?
Believe me after the last ten years, I promise the lawyers on here they will NEVER hear a lawyer joke from me, because the so-called media has proven themselves to be the lowest of the low.
Reply 29 - Posted by:
O.S. Banker, 4/18/2013 8:37:58 AM (No. 9282076)
Contrary to the lies that you have read, 90% of Americans do not support gun control. Rather, 90% of a highly skewed and statistically flawed survey support gun control. And most of those respondents have a delusional view of their own personal security.
I realize that it will pain you to hear this, but if gun control had been the law of the land some 250 years ago,, well we would probably still be waking up to tea instead of coffee, and winding down with Tanqueray & tonic instead of Bourbon & branch water. We are a nation because we rebelled against an all powerful central government. That spirit of rebellion still lives in some of us. While we are content if our government confines its activities to those delineated in the Constitution, we now have 100 years of encroachment.
I hope that we can achieve a restoration of balance via the ballot box. If that proves impossible, I hope that my fellow countrymen will agree to an amicable seperation so that we can all pursue our iteration of the American Dream. But if history is any guide wthat power is rarely peacefully ceded. The first American Revolution was a success, the second a failure. Who knows what the third will bring. know a
If 90% of Americans were for it, then the 10% against it must all live in Arkyland. Our full tilt Bozo fascist socialist Dem Senator, Pryor, voted against every gun grabbing legislation put to a vote. The only reason this Reid lapdog voted the way he did is that he knows Arkyland would not tolerate a Senator that is anti 2nd Amendment. And we let him know that. Too bad Arizona doesn´t have the luxury of McLame being up for reelection. It might have changed his usual safe Dem vote.
I was listening to the talk show I normally do about this subject and a caller to the show expressed that he wished Obama would have been this upset after the Boston Marathon terror. Obama never seems to get upset at the mass injury or killing of people but more so at his policy failings.
The Left are trying to stitch up the American People so that we cannot resist their true intentions. Just look at what they have and seek to impose:
- Punish "the rich" (which includes most of us). People with money are independent of the government (bad).
- Place TSA agents under control of the federal government at all airports and train stations. This controls our mobility, because mobility without permission is bad.
- Restrict and then confiscate guns from the people (guns make it hard to round us up).
- Have healthcare turned over to the feds, thus they will have access to your personal files and medical care. Mental health is also controlled by the feds. Do you think the President of the United States couldn´t have one of the bureaucrats controlling Obamacare deem you or I mentally unfit and have us rounded up?
So with no money, guns, travel, nor doctor care, we can be pushed around without limit.
Add to this the army of mindless drones who are being cranked out of schools, dependent on free handouts, or are illegal foreign nationals being granted voting rights, together with the duplicitous press, and we are in a world of trouble.
Don`t think gun control legislation is dead. Once started, these things never go away. Think healthcare. Hillary couldn`t get it through in `93, but it made it in 2010. Immigration was stopped in 2007, but that is being rammed through today with the help of the GOP. The GOP could have opened ANWAR during the Bush Years but voted against it. Too much Saudi money coming their way. It`s just a matter of time before another attempt to take away guns will be tried. DC will just take another approach. Whatever grand plan these DC knuckleheads have in store will eventually rear its ugly head. We are just in the way as far as they are concerned. DC won`t be happy until they have dumbed down our society to the point whereby they can stay in office indefinitely without even having to be voted on.
We should consider ourselves at war with our govn. We will have to fight daily to hold on to our Constitution.
#29 and 30. Apparently neither of you are informed of facts. Tim Stanley nor the Telegraph did not originate that 90% figure. It was Obama himself telling everyone that and liberals on this side of the pond have been using it in their own self righteous mode. I´ve read it in several places.
I think you both owe Mr. Stanley and the Telegraph an apology.
Let´s not forget that 56 Senators were willing to sell us out. Obama will campaign and community organize now night and day until the 2014 election. His objective will be to get to 60 votes in the Senate and control of the House. Then if, God forbid, a Conservative justice is lost to the SCOTUS...
If he is true to his M.O., he will demonize Republicans as baby killers (while conveniently sidestepping Gosnell). A community organizer must have a villain and the NRA will replace the Tea Party. Get ready for an all out assault.
These days, input from non-domestic news sources - especially British and Canadian - is often more reliable than input from domestic news sources. Our domestic agencies are often too close to (or too involved in) the issues. Trashing the messenger, #26, is a waste of time.
Where I disagree is that the issue is dead. Reid´s vote positions him to re-introduce it. Liberals are like zombies: they keep coming back. They will keep trying to find a way.
I´m going to say this again. There´s already background checks at gun shows and there are NO internet sales without FFL dealers and registration taking place. The only sales on the internet are for curio and relics which are classified by the ATF as non lethal, non firing relics all firearms pre-1898.
There was more in this bill that would restrict gun ownership than background checks and the internet. Obama and his anti-gun zealots want to classify citizens with some mentally disturbed tags to prohibit the purchase of a firearm in the first place. Like a returning veteran who experienced trama. Obamacare will have a provision where the doctor will ask if you own a firearm.
There are sneaky things the left will try to prevent the purchase of firearms and they won´t stop.
Reply 53 - Posted by:
O.S. Banker, 4/18/2013 10:57:27 AM (No. 9282369)
I re-read my previous posting, and while I am annoyed with the stray words that my tablet elected to tag to the end, I don´t see any accusation of Mr. Stanley nor the Telegraph being the source of the ´90%´ statistic. Rather I thought that I made it clear that the source of the statistic was from a manipulated survey. I suppose that I can expand my posting style to include more details, but I do like to keep within the word count limits established by our host.
Much as I like Great Britain and love Scotland, I realize that they experience as much confusion in reading about our politics as we do of theirs. If Mr. Stanley thinks that I attributed the statistics to him falsely, I will offer an apology for my butchering of the English Language.
I suspect that 90% is one of those numbers that they pulled out of an orifice. If the truth be known, it is probably more like 60 or 70% against this kind of grab for power by the dems.
I believe that it failed because being the politician he is, Harry Reid would rather take this kind of defeat now, than risk taking a total pasting in 2014. He will protect his power before helping even Obama.
I know this sounds kind of crazy, but several months ago, I read a short press statement from Harry Reid that indicated that he was very doubtful that this legislation would pass. He was more interested in protecting dem seats in the 2014 election at that point. If one pays attention to the news, particularly Thurs-Sat mornings, you can get the most interesting, and truthful, bits of information.
I´m glad to see this bill defeated. If passed I could envision it being a major gun control plan. Who is going to pay for the background check(gun applicants) and no mention of what they would charge. Then once in the bureaucrats hands the delay would be so long the person would die of old age before getting the OK.
Gun control, is the politically correct (communist) phrase for People Control. Just like the phony phrase "War on Drugs" that is actually, The War On People, mostly users The words, "Drug control" is a joke. At the very least, it means gun confiscaion. In all fairness it simply is the communist driven scheme to a horrifying new People Control.
Fortunately, despite the brainwashing Schumers, Weinsteins, Obamas, Diane Sawyers, the American gun culture is made up of this country´s most hard working, strongest, most law abiding people in our population. The quiet, accomplished citizens who make this country the greatest country in history are the gun owners.
Unfortunately the communist driven voices against private gun ownership, all have their own gun carrying bodyguards, and their own closet full of guns.The Congress, the impersonator in the White House and most of the press and media are just plain sick in the head.
You couldn´t get 90% of Americans to agree on any subject you can think of, much less background checks and/or gun control. If you had an elephant in the room and someone said "there´s an elephant in here", someone would say "no, it´s just a mouse with a glandular problem". You could, however, get 90% of selected persons from carefully selected states to agree with whatever you want to ask.
And I´m like others here. Don´t think for one minute that the dims have given up on gun control. They will just bide their time and start all over again when the time is ripe. And they´ll come at you from a different angle. They´ve been working this way for decades.
I do not owe Mr. Stanley an apology. I make my point again: journolisters repeat speculation as fact and are never called on the carpet for it. So what if Obama is the one who originated it! Mr. Stanley can´t find the data to back it up? It just shows more sycophancy to repeat whatever the President says as fact when its obvious that the President can´t even be bothered with backing his statement up.
Journalists are lower than lawyers in my estimation.
#22 said " Personally, I love it when Obama bangs his little fists on his high chair."
Obama looked like a cartoon baby , the only thing missing was the diaper and the rattle. Personally, I was hoping that he became so unhinged that he started speaking using the vernacular he uses in private with Jay Z and Reggie Love. Lots of street lingo and profanity. You know he wanted to. Blankey blanking Republicans.
And frankly, I don’t need a lecture about my lack of compassion for dead children from a man who voted against protecting live children who were born as a result of a botched abortion!
And furthermore, I don’t want to hear the hypocritical whining about the Senate ignoring the will of the people from a President who – along with the liberal leadership in Washington – shoved ObamaCare down the throats of millions of unwilling Americans despite majority opposition to the law.
do you believe ONE word obozo says? I don´t! Let’s call spades spades. Gun control – the only reason for gun control is to leave us, freedom loving Americans, defenseless. Like all fascist/commie regimes they want us to be weak and obedient. I don’t believe any other arguments. Rush talks about 2014 elections, other commentators mention different reasons. Imo, they want to disarm us, so brownshirts can easily round us up and the vocal oppositioners will be send to Gulag! It is not obozo! It is leftist cabal who runs the politics nowadays - government, mainstream media, including all the googles, twitters and the rest... I have seen this on much lighter scale in the USSR (the lighter means the KGB didn´t have the computers, satellites and all this high tech stuff). Now, when I came to this "free" country I feel more scared than I was 20-30 years ago.
Add to #72: these are googles, twitters and like who circulate those 90% numbers. Let´s face it - leftists (commies/fascists) are better at community organizing. I know the reason - they have our money and use it for their cause. Lenin/hitler knew that - to win the revolution you have to have media and banks. And our lefties have it today!
I´d like to be a fly on the wall, so to speak, when Valerie Jarrett excoriates the Won for his feeble ineffective effort on Total Gun Control Legislation. Poor Obama probably will wet his pants then and now?
The 90% was from an ABC/WSJ poll. Unbiased I´m sure. There are already background checks for online sales, same is true for gun shows. But you know the old saying, if you tell a lie long enough and loud enough..... I don´t object to background checks per se. But Im inclined to think this administration will use "expanded" checks to infringe on law abiding people. But I´m a cynic.
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